Utilsigtet Hændelse KSC 18/6 (desværre på engelsk)
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Utilsigtet Hændelse KSC 18/6 (desværre på engelsk)
German firearms advertisement. Ammo may explode but german firearms from the 40's will not.
There was an incident today that is still unexplained even though it was investigated. I am safe and a lucky bastard, as always.
I was at the range zeroing a hunting rifle and shooting both regular hunting ammo and fmj ammo as well as specialty reduced loads from the swedish military and some odd saloon loads.
First i shot a series of the akward rounds, then fmj , then saloon rounds, then hunting ammo and then another type of Norma hunting rounds, the latter type was from an unknown source but factory rounds, not handloaded.
First shot was fine, second round was without particular recoil but with such a backwards blast that made my face numb and immediately drew blood from the area around my right eye (I am a lefthanded shooter). I tried to unload the gun to no avail before leaving the range to inspect the injuries in the mirror of my car 100 meters/110 yards away. At this time I was not sure whether my rifle had malfunctioned or I had been struck by a round from another gun from another range at the shooting facility (seems awkward but when something strikes your face in a shooting range you keep your options open till gun and face has been inspected).
I went to the car while calling the range officer (the guy at the shop at the range 400meters away) saying " I have had an accident, nothing big, but come here as my guns are unsupervised as i try to check my injury (I was alone at the range).
He arrives, I wash my face. nothing bad since it was everywhere around my eye but not in my eye.
Then we go check the rifle and we cannot open the bolt at all, even banging it on the table does little. the floor plate has been almost blown out so with some work we manage to empty the magazine from below.
The RO inspects the ammo and agrees that it is factory norma, old though and with dark brass.
The verdict to begin with, based on what we can see is a squib (a squib is when a projectile doesnt fully leave the barrel and a second round is loaded and fired so the the barrel explodes or otherwise causes unpleasant situations)
We agree that further shooting today is unfeasible since the situation may damage my trust in the various ammo types i brought and so on, causing shitty results, and my stuff was full of blood anyway so f... k it.
So what happened?
I went home and put a cleaning rod down the barrel. To my big surprise there were no blockages at all. I could put it down to the bottom of the un-extractable casing. No stuck bullets in the barrel at all so now it becomes mysterious. It took serious banging with a hammer to get the bolt handle up and back and what I saw was a "melted" case.
What the hell happened???
There was an incident today that is still unexplained even though it was investigated. I am safe and a lucky bastard, as always.
I was at the range zeroing a hunting rifle and shooting both regular hunting ammo and fmj ammo as well as specialty reduced loads from the swedish military and some odd saloon loads.
First i shot a series of the akward rounds, then fmj , then saloon rounds, then hunting ammo and then another type of Norma hunting rounds, the latter type was from an unknown source but factory rounds, not handloaded.
First shot was fine, second round was without particular recoil but with such a backwards blast that made my face numb and immediately drew blood from the area around my right eye (I am a lefthanded shooter). I tried to unload the gun to no avail before leaving the range to inspect the injuries in the mirror of my car 100 meters/110 yards away. At this time I was not sure whether my rifle had malfunctioned or I had been struck by a round from another gun from another range at the shooting facility (seems awkward but when something strikes your face in a shooting range you keep your options open till gun and face has been inspected).
I went to the car while calling the range officer (the guy at the shop at the range 400meters away) saying " I have had an accident, nothing big, but come here as my guns are unsupervised as i try to check my injury (I was alone at the range).
He arrives, I wash my face. nothing bad since it was everywhere around my eye but not in my eye.
Then we go check the rifle and we cannot open the bolt at all, even banging it on the table does little. the floor plate has been almost blown out so with some work we manage to empty the magazine from below.
The RO inspects the ammo and agrees that it is factory norma, old though and with dark brass.
The verdict to begin with, based on what we can see is a squib (a squib is when a projectile doesnt fully leave the barrel and a second round is loaded and fired so the the barrel explodes or otherwise causes unpleasant situations)
We agree that further shooting today is unfeasible since the situation may damage my trust in the various ammo types i brought and so on, causing shitty results, and my stuff was full of blood anyway so f... k it.
So what happened?
I went home and put a cleaning rod down the barrel. To my big surprise there were no blockages at all. I could put it down to the bottom of the un-extractable casing. No stuck bullets in the barrel at all so now it becomes mysterious. It took serious banging with a hammer to get the bolt handle up and back and what I saw was a "melted" case.
What the hell happened???
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Re: Utilsigtet Hændelse KSC 18/6 (desværre på engelsk)
Seems like you have had a lot of pressure blowing back. A blocked barrel could be the case... but i am not sure
I would think that the action or barrel would blow up? (Try Google rifle squib). But maybe an old german will hold up?
#edit: køre vi tråden på dansk ?
I would think that the action or barrel would blow up? (Try Google rifle squib). But maybe an old german will hold up?
#edit: køre vi tråden på dansk ?
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Re: Utilsigtet Hændelse KSC 18/6 (desværre på engelsk)
Altså, jeg er frisk på begge sprogRas.Killing skrev: ↑18. jun 2020, 01:19Seems like you have had a lot of pressure blowing back. A blocked barrel could be the case... but i am not sure
I would think that the action or barrel would blow up? (Try Google rifle squib). But maybe an old german will hold up?
#edit: køre vi tråden på dansk ?
Mit helt ukvalificerede gæt er, at hylsteret har været svagt i bunden, men (relativt) stærkere mod halsen. Måske har noget af krudtet endda klumpet sig sammen i bunden, brændt af på en gang, fyret trykket bagud og kun en smule fremad (nok til, at projektilet kunne forlade løbet). Hylsterbunden er simpelthen blevet trykket bagud.
Men hvordan forklarer det blødningen? Jeg synes ikke at læse noget om, at låsen blev blæst bagud (og det kræver vel et helt sindssygt overtryk, eventuelt kombineret med en out-of-battery-antænding,hvis det skal ske i en bolt action.)
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Re: Utilsigtet Hændelse KSC 18/6 (desværre på engelsk)
Når hylsterbunden ser sådan ud, så er det sandsynligvis et lille stykke messing der er blevet blæst bagud af låsen.
Når statsmænd tyr til vold, er det menneskeheden der lider.
( ͡° ͜ʖ ͡°)
Det tager kun 2 minutter ..........
( ͡° ͜ʖ ͡°)
Det tager kun 2 minutter ..........
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Re: Utilsigtet Hændelse KSC 18/6 (desværre på engelsk)
Don't tell you didn't wore any shooting glases?
"And on the third day God created the Remington bolt action rifle...Amen."
"If shooting glasses had always been worn, it is reasonable to assume that many [...] injuries would have been prevented or reduced in severity." (Maj.Gen. Julian S. Hatcher)
"If shooting glasses had always been worn, it is reasonable to assume that many [...] injuries would have been prevented or reduced in severity." (Maj.Gen. Julian S. Hatcher)
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Re: Utilsigtet Hændelse KSC 18/6 (desværre på engelsk)
ja bare på dansk. som jeg nævner mistænkte jeg en squib men der var intet i løbet da jeg fik checket.Ras.Killing skrev: ↑18. jun 2020, 01:19Seems like you have had a lot of pressure blowing back. A blocked barrel could be the case... but i am not sure
I would think that the action or barrel would blow up? (Try Google rifle squib). But maybe an old german will hold up?
#edit: køre vi tråden på dansk ?
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Re: Utilsigtet Hændelse KSC 18/6 (desværre på engelsk)
låsen flyttede sig ikke, faktisk kunne den ikke åbnes uden voldsom brug af hammer, ikke engang en gummihammer kunne gøre detFlugteren skrev: ↑18. jun 2020, 02:16Altså, jeg er frisk på begge sprogRas.Killing skrev: ↑18. jun 2020, 01:19Seems like you have had a lot of pressure blowing back. A blocked barrel could be the case... but i am not sure
I would think that the action or barrel would blow up? (Try Google rifle squib). But maybe an old german will hold up?
#edit: køre vi tråden på dansk ?
Mit helt ukvalificerede gæt er, at hylsteret har været svagt i bunden, men (relativt) stærkere mod halsen. Måske har noget af krudtet endda klumpet sig sammen i bunden, brændt af på en gang, fyret trykket bagud og kun en smule fremad (nok til, at projektilet kunne forlade løbet). Hylsterbunden er simpelthen blevet trykket bagud.
Men hvordan forklarer det blødningen? Jeg synes ikke at læse noget om, at låsen blev blæst bagud (og det kræver vel et helt sindssygt overtryk, eventuelt kombineret med en out-of-battery-antænding,hvis det skal ske i en bolt action.)
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Re: Utilsigtet Hændelse KSC 18/6 (desværre på engelsk)
Hvordan opstod blødningen?Cp-Medic skrev: ↑18. jun 2020, 09:08låsen flyttede sig ikke, faktisk kunne den ikke åbnes uden voldsom brug af hammer, ikke engang en gummihammer kunne gøre detFlugteren skrev: ↑18. jun 2020, 02:16Altså, jeg er frisk på begge sprogRas.Killing skrev: ↑18. jun 2020, 01:19Seems like you have had a lot of pressure blowing back. A blocked barrel could be the case... but i am not sure
I would think that the action or barrel would blow up? (Try Google rifle squib). But maybe an old german will hold up?
#edit: køre vi tråden på dansk ?
Mit helt ukvalificerede gæt er, at hylsteret har været svagt i bunden, men (relativt) stærkere mod halsen. Måske har noget af krudtet endda klumpet sig sammen i bunden, brændt af på en gang, fyret trykket bagud og kun en smule fremad (nok til, at projektilet kunne forlade løbet). Hylsterbunden er simpelthen blevet trykket bagud.
Men hvordan forklarer det blødningen? Jeg synes ikke at læse noget om, at låsen blev blæst bagud (og det kræver vel et helt sindssygt overtryk, eventuelt kombineret med en out-of-battery-antænding,hvis det skal ske i en bolt action.)
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Re: Utilsigtet Hændelse KSC 18/6 (desværre på engelsk)
fragmenter, men fra hvad vides ikke, det er flere steder rundt om øjet men lige præcis ikke i øjet så jeg købte et skrabelod på tanken på vej hjem.
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Re: Utilsigtet Hændelse KSC 18/6 (desværre på engelsk)
Uhyggelig historie. Har du fået tjekket dit syn?
Hvilke Skydebriller bruger du fremover?
Hvilke Skydebriller bruger du fremover?
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Re: Utilsigtet Hændelse KSC 18/6 (desværre på engelsk)
nej jeg tror det er okay.. det "sjove" er at jeg seævsamme dag har 3 mælkekasser skydebriller stående i stuen forsi jeg havde besluttet mig at tynde ud i dem, men nu ryger der et par wiley x i skydetasken
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Re: Utilsigtet Hændelse KSC 18/6 (desværre på engelsk)
Bruger også Wiley X - har set flere af disse sager til at jeg tør skyde uden briller på.
Du har godt nok været heldig!
og det kan ikke være fra en squib som evt har siddet langt nok ude til at blive losset ud af løbet da næste skud kom?
Fragmenterne du har fået i ansigtet kan jo ikke komme fra fronten men ja - godt det endte uden permanente mén.
Du har godt nok været heldig!
og det kan ikke være fra en squib som evt har siddet langt nok ude til at blive losset ud af løbet da næste skud kom?
Fragmenterne du har fået i ansigtet kan jo ikke komme fra fronten men ja - godt det endte uden permanente mén.
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Re: Utilsigtet Hændelse KSC 18/6 (desværre på engelsk)
Pyha, godt ok heldigt der ikke skete noget med øjnene!
Det hele er foregået med fabriksammunition og et stykke henne i skydningen?
Du skriver i datid:
Det hele er foregået med fabriksammunition og et stykke henne i skydningen?
Du skriver i datid:
Men jeg er ikke sikker på om jeg forstår dig korrekt, du skyder alle ovenstående skud og så:First i shot a series of the akward rounds, then fmj , then saloon rounds, then hunting ammo and then another type of Norma hunting rounds, the latter type was from an unknown source but factory rounds, not handloaded.
Eller var det dagens første skud?First shot was fine, second round was without particular recoil but with such a backwards blast that made my face numb and immediately drew blood
/bofh
"never attribute to malice that which is adequately explained by stupidity"
Hanlons razor
"never attribute to malice that which is adequately explained by stupidity"
Hanlons razor
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Re: Utilsigtet Hændelse KSC 18/6 (desværre på engelsk)
jeg habde skudt 19 skud inden. dette var skud nummer 2 af 5 norma patroner jeg havde puttet i magasinet
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Re: Utilsigtet Hændelse KSC 18/6 (desværre på engelsk)
Ja måske en selvrensende squib, den mulighed havde jeg også overvejet for ellers giver det ikke rigtig nogen mening at der kan komme så stort tryk
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Re: Utilsigtet Hændelse KSC 18/6 (desværre på engelsk)
Ok :-)
Så er det i hvert fald ikke rester af rensegrej ;-)
/bofh
"never attribute to malice that which is adequately explained by stupidity"
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Re: Utilsigtet Hændelse KSC 18/6 (desværre på engelsk)
en squib vil efterlade spor i piben i form af en sæk.
Men kun hvis projektilet har "tid" til at komme op i hastighed, ellers er der mulighed for at det bare blive skubbet ud.
Jeg er med på teorien om at krudtet har været delvist nedbrudt, hæmmerne i krudtet er væk og krudtet har opført sig som en meget hurtigere krudt type end tilsigtet.
Mauser låsen er fint stærk og dem jeg har har gas udblæsnings kanal(er) og de kan tage noget gas, men når hylster bunden forsvinder, så har de ikke en ærlig chance.
Og for at være ærlig, almindelige sikkerhedsbriller er beregnet til at tage fragmenter med 1J, her er potentialet meget højere.
Det her får mig til at ønske en riffel der har låsen i en meget lukket låse stol ala en sauer 200str
Men kun hvis projektilet har "tid" til at komme op i hastighed, ellers er der mulighed for at det bare blive skubbet ud.
Jeg er med på teorien om at krudtet har været delvist nedbrudt, hæmmerne i krudtet er væk og krudtet har opført sig som en meget hurtigere krudt type end tilsigtet.
Mauser låsen er fint stærk og dem jeg har har gas udblæsnings kanal(er) og de kan tage noget gas, men når hylster bunden forsvinder, så har de ikke en ærlig chance.
Og for at være ærlig, almindelige sikkerhedsbriller er beregnet til at tage fragmenter med 1J, her er potentialet meget højere.
Det her får mig til at ønske en riffel der har låsen i en meget lukket låse stol ala en sauer 200str
Kun mængden af varm luft er begrænsningen på hvor højt politikerne stiger til vejrs
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Re: Utilsigtet Hændelse KSC 18/6 (desværre på engelsk)
En squib vil være skubbet ud af næste skud.
Ellers ville piben være beskadiget.
Selvom en Mauserlås er stærk, så understøtter den hylstret dårligt ved udtrækkeren.
En Mauserlås ønsker man ikke at overlade for meget.
Det viser destruktive tests, men denne hændelse gør det også ret fint.
Ellers ville piben være beskadiget.
Selvom en Mauserlås er stærk, så understøtter den hylstret dårligt ved udtrækkeren.
En Mauserlås ønsker man ikke at overlade for meget.
Det viser destruktive tests, men denne hændelse gør det også ret fint.
Østbirk Pistolskytter og
Sportsskytteklubben Mildot
Sportsskytteklubben Mildot
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Re: Utilsigtet Hændelse KSC 18/6 (desværre på engelsk)
den mauserlås har gjort det rigtigt godt.tør ikke gætte på gastrykket,men vil tro at det kan lave de fleste rifler om til spåner og savsmuld.nedbrudt krudt har jeg hørt omtalt som brisant.egen erfaring rækker til voldsom rekyl og brug af moderat vold for at åbne låsen.(8x57)gammel ammo udgør helt sikkert en risiko,og som nævnt flere gange er det en god ide at adskille et par stykker og tjekke for korrosion og syrlig lugt.hvis krudet virker klistret eller klumper er det heller ikke godt.et par gode skydebriller er en god inverstering i tilfælde af hylstersprængning.glædeligt der ikke skete mere end der gjorde.personligt ville jeg skrotte riflen.
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Re: Utilsigtet Hændelse KSC 18/6 (desværre på engelsk)
Godt du er ok! Kunne være gået meget værre.Cp-Medic skrev: ↑18. jun 2020, 00:08German firearms advertisement. Ammo may explode but german firearms from the 40's will not.
There was an incident today that is still unexplained even though it was investigated. I am safe and a lucky bastard, as always.
I was at the range zeroing a hunting rifle and shooting both regular hunting ammo and fmj ammo as well as specialty reduced loads from the swedish military and some odd saloon loads.
First i shot a series of the akward rounds, then fmj , then saloon rounds, then hunting ammo and then another type of Norma hunting rounds, the latter type was from an unknown source but factory rounds, not handloaded.
First shot was fine, second round was without particular recoil but with such a backwards blast that made my face numb and immediately drew blood from the area around my right eye (I am a lefthanded shooter). I tried to unload the gun to no avail before leaving the range to inspect the injuries in the mirror of my car 100 meters/110 yards away. At this time I was not sure whether my rifle had malfunctioned or I had been struck by a round from another gun from another range at the shooting facility (seems awkward but when something strikes your face in a shooting range you keep your options open till gun and face has been inspected).
I went to the car while calling the range officer (the guy at the shop at the range 400meters away) saying " I have had an accident, nothing big, but come here as my guns are unsupervised as i try to check my injury (I was alone at the range).
He arrives, I wash my face. nothing bad since it was everywhere around my eye but not in my eye.
Then we go check the rifle and we cannot open the bolt at all, even banging it on the table does little. the floor plate has been almost blown out so with some work we manage to empty the magazine from below.
The RO inspects the ammo and agrees that it is factory norma, old though and with dark brass.
The verdict to begin with, based on what we can see is a squib (a squib is when a projectile doesnt fully leave the barrel and a second round is loaded and fired so the the barrel explodes or otherwise causes unpleasant situations)
We agree that further shooting today is unfeasible since the situation may damage my trust in the various ammo types i brought and so on, causing shitty results, and my stuff was full of blood anyway so f... k it.
So what happened?
I went home and put a cleaning rod down the barrel. To my big surprise there were no blockages at all. I could put it down to the bottom of the un-extractable casing. No stuck bullets in the barrel at all so now it becomes mysterious. It took serious banging with a hammer to get the bolt handle up and back and what I saw was a "melted" case.
What the hell happened???
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Re: Utilsigtet Hændelse KSC 18/6 (desværre på engelsk)
Hello everyone!
Not being an expert on exploding guns; But this seems to be a K98 Mauser in 8x57. Could this simply be the well known 8x57 J vs. 8x57 JS disaster? (I.e mixing two identical rounds with slightly different bullet diameters?...)
Best/S200
Not being an expert on exploding guns; But this seems to be a K98 Mauser in 8x57. Could this simply be the well known 8x57 J vs. 8x57 JS disaster? (I.e mixing two identical rounds with slightly different bullet diameters?...)
Best/S200
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Re: Utilsigtet Hændelse KSC 18/6 (desværre på engelsk)
hello.here in denmark there is an abundance of these rebuilt mausers.the vast majority in 6.5x55 swedish.for the author and most gunnuts in denmark caliber is obvious.
brgds.
brgds.
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Re: Utilsigtet Hændelse KSC 18/6 (desværre på engelsk)
Oh - sorry, I was not aware that the exploded gun was converted to 6,5x55.
Best/S200
Best/S200